All of the above. Rising through the degrees should be a challenge. Another way to weed out unqualified men before they take leadership. If you can't dedicate the time necessary to prove proficiency in memorization, esoterics, history, and morality, then you don't have time for the fraternity. And I'll hear nothing about so and so…
All of the above. Rising through the degrees should be a challenge. Another way to weed out unqualified men before they take leadership. If you can't dedicate the time necessary to prove proficiency in memorization, esoterics, history, and morality, then you don't have time for the fraternity. And I'll hear nothing about so and so has trouble with memorization... then he will have to work a little harder or find a different fraternity. Our historic brethren didn't lower standards, and neither should we.
In the most friendly manner ... really? If he can't memorize "then he will have to work a little harder or find a different fraternity"? I'm pretty sure we don't claim that we make good men memorize better, so how did memorization become such a defining quality?
Is there another way a good man can prove his commitment to our Fraternity, because I've got to say that memorization seems like a pretty arbitrary quality. We've all heard others wax eloquently about the Masons they've known and what impressed them the most. Kindness, generous, faithful, fair minded, helpful ... not once have I ever heard anyone say, "Yes, my grandfather was a Mason. Wow, he had such a great memory." Or at least I can't remember anyone saying anything like that.
Let's look through the other comments here. Of the two men mentioned who had legitimate TBI related issues with the work. One of them took the extra effort to work past his disability and succeed in the fraternity. The other turned out to be too lazy to be a good contributor anyway. It is possible to overcome. It might be harder for some than others. But those high standards are crucial to provide an elite experience. Is this an elite fraternity,or just the moose club with aprons? If it's elite, we need to have barriers to entry and advancement. If its lowest common man, I guess I need to be the one to leave, because my experience thus far has been well below my expectations of the oldest, most elite men's fraternity in the world.
Brother Jack, Again in the most friendly manner, if you came here to judge other Brothers then perhaps you are in the wrong place. I hope that's not the case. Rather, I hope you'd consider that there are legitimate reasons why memory skills are much better in some and much worse in others, and the reasons for much worse memory skills aren't limited to "legitimate" injuries.
We all show up with flaws. Some are more obvious than others, and and some are far more serious than poor memory skills. If on balance a man is a good man our first obligation is to meet him on the level. Even those placed on the lowest spoke of fortune's wheel are entitled to our regard.
Regard and kind offices yes. Membership? No. We rightly limit membership to those physically mentally spiritually and financially stable. A fool isn't a clown. It's a person of limited mental capacity.
Brother Jack, with all due respect, I know of Brothers gifted with finance and numbers, others adept with mechanical items while other the talent of the arts. Memorization is not the sole attribute of mental capacity. Yes, maintaining tradition is vital and proficiency is necessary to rise to or through leadership.
Oral and written exams can also demonstrate a deep and full understanding of the morality, fraternity, symbiology and esoteric history of the craft. Time within the Lodge can inspire and hone the memorization, especially if a Brother wishes to rise.
I believe in allowing the combination of both if someone is struggling.
As stated by others, I know of someone who has a neurological condition that makes memorization difficult, but has an complete ability to fully understand and express things. It is not a question of mental capacity. I would not want to think this good man would not be accepted into our fraternity if he so chose to join.
Outside of the fraternity in a work environment, a newly hired employee struggled to get their work done in time. They began to doubt themselves to continue and management was close to giving up on them. After a long while it finally "clicked" for them and went on to become one of the best employees I've seen. Thorough, competent and very well liked. They even went on to become an excellent trainer of new employees. My point being, everyone has different learning methods and timelines. Through patience, repetition and consistent exposure to others doing the work, they became very adept.
has difficulty yes. But can. He just has to work hard at it. That's the point. Hard work. Rising through the degrees shouldn't be easy for anyone. Putting on a good program of any kind requires a certain amount of recitation and public speaking. The degree work is a theatrical play. Would you hire an actor who has to read his lines? My grammar school Christmas pageant wouldn't even tolerate that level of sloth from 6 year Olds. Any man who says he can't memorize must be completely unable to communicate. How else could he possibly remember English vocabulary? I'm not good at memorization myself. It took me 90 hours of repetition to learn my EA posting lecture. I am a better man for it because I hadn't tried to do that level of memorization since participating in a high-school play 25 years before. Standards should be high.
All of the above. Rising through the degrees should be a challenge. Another way to weed out unqualified men before they take leadership. If you can't dedicate the time necessary to prove proficiency in memorization, esoterics, history, and morality, then you don't have time for the fraternity. And I'll hear nothing about so and so has trouble with memorization... then he will have to work a little harder or find a different fraternity. Our historic brethren didn't lower standards, and neither should we.
Brother Jack,
In the most friendly manner ... really? If he can't memorize "then he will have to work a little harder or find a different fraternity"? I'm pretty sure we don't claim that we make good men memorize better, so how did memorization become such a defining quality?
Is there another way a good man can prove his commitment to our Fraternity, because I've got to say that memorization seems like a pretty arbitrary quality. We've all heard others wax eloquently about the Masons they've known and what impressed them the most. Kindness, generous, faithful, fair minded, helpful ... not once have I ever heard anyone say, "Yes, my grandfather was a Mason. Wow, he had such a great memory." Or at least I can't remember anyone saying anything like that.
Let's look through the other comments here. Of the two men mentioned who had legitimate TBI related issues with the work. One of them took the extra effort to work past his disability and succeed in the fraternity. The other turned out to be too lazy to be a good contributor anyway. It is possible to overcome. It might be harder for some than others. But those high standards are crucial to provide an elite experience. Is this an elite fraternity,or just the moose club with aprons? If it's elite, we need to have barriers to entry and advancement. If its lowest common man, I guess I need to be the one to leave, because my experience thus far has been well below my expectations of the oldest, most elite men's fraternity in the world.
Brother Jack, Again in the most friendly manner, if you came here to judge other Brothers then perhaps you are in the wrong place. I hope that's not the case. Rather, I hope you'd consider that there are legitimate reasons why memory skills are much better in some and much worse in others, and the reasons for much worse memory skills aren't limited to "legitimate" injuries.
We all show up with flaws. Some are more obvious than others, and and some are far more serious than poor memory skills. If on balance a man is a good man our first obligation is to meet him on the level. Even those placed on the lowest spoke of fortune's wheel are entitled to our regard.
Regard and kind offices yes. Membership? No. We rightly limit membership to those physically mentally spiritually and financially stable. A fool isn't a clown. It's a person of limited mental capacity.
Brother Jack, with all due respect, I know of Brothers gifted with finance and numbers, others adept with mechanical items while other the talent of the arts. Memorization is not the sole attribute of mental capacity. Yes, maintaining tradition is vital and proficiency is necessary to rise to or through leadership.
Oral and written exams can also demonstrate a deep and full understanding of the morality, fraternity, symbiology and esoteric history of the craft. Time within the Lodge can inspire and hone the memorization, especially if a Brother wishes to rise.
I believe in allowing the combination of both if someone is struggling.
As stated by others, I know of someone who has a neurological condition that makes memorization difficult, but has an complete ability to fully understand and express things. It is not a question of mental capacity. I would not want to think this good man would not be accepted into our fraternity if he so chose to join.
Outside of the fraternity in a work environment, a newly hired employee struggled to get their work done in time. They began to doubt themselves to continue and management was close to giving up on them. After a long while it finally "clicked" for them and went on to become one of the best employees I've seen. Thorough, competent and very well liked. They even went on to become an excellent trainer of new employees. My point being, everyone has different learning methods and timelines. Through patience, repetition and consistent exposure to others doing the work, they became very adept.
has difficulty yes. But can. He just has to work hard at it. That's the point. Hard work. Rising through the degrees shouldn't be easy for anyone. Putting on a good program of any kind requires a certain amount of recitation and public speaking. The degree work is a theatrical play. Would you hire an actor who has to read his lines? My grammar school Christmas pageant wouldn't even tolerate that level of sloth from 6 year Olds. Any man who says he can't memorize must be completely unable to communicate. How else could he possibly remember English vocabulary? I'm not good at memorization myself. It took me 90 hours of repetition to learn my EA posting lecture. I am a better man for it because I hadn't tried to do that level of memorization since participating in a high-school play 25 years before. Standards should be high.