Im quite lucky to live 30 minutes from 5 lodges, indeed 2 of them are minutes from my house. I can travel to at least 4 more in under an hour.
I think for me, an hour is the furthest I would want to go if I wanted to be a member of a Lodge. If I am a member, I want to be active. I want to be able to help with the building and in the community. That means I need to be available.
While not addressed in your post, distance also matters for traveling to visit, for as I mentioned, I have quite a few close by. If a lodge is under 1.5 hours, odds are ive visited it already and try to do so on a regular occasion. If its more then 2 hours, I need a very compelling reason to do so.
>>>While not addressed in your post, distance also matters for traveling to visit, for as I >>>mentioned, I have quite a few close by. If a lodge is under 1.5 hours, odds are ive visited it >>>already and try to do so on a regular occasion. If its more then 2 hours, I need a very >>>compelling reason to do so.
Your point is extremely well taken.
But, for me, it is a different reason. I'm willing, and able, to travel long distances to visit a Lodge, but for me (unless someone else is going with me) it depends on the roadway. I see very poorly at night, and it has been that way for me for a long time now. I can easily drive on the freeway or other similarly lighted roadways, but some of our Lodges are served by very dark back roads, and I have great difficulty driving on them. There are Lodges I avoid for simply that reason.
I feel lucky to have completed my degrees in a lodge that fit me within 15 minutes of my house. I think fit is important. My lodge had potential members visit other lodges in the area to be sure we were the best for them. I have moved out of state and the lodge in my new hometown doesn't fit me. I am still looking for the right fit.
While distance shouldn't be the only factor I feel you need to be able to assist the lodge by more than attendance. Distance is a big part of the length of my cable tow.
I agree, it is really important that potential Masons visit other area Lodges to ensure that they choose the one that best fits them. Far too often I think we lose men from Masonry simply because they petitioned the first Lodge they encountered, and it ended up not gelling with their personality or interests. It's certainly sad if a Lodge a town over would have been a better fit, and able to retain them.
Maybe it's important to find a Lodge that vibes with your internal vision of the kind of Mason you want to grow up to be, and maybe that's more important than distance. Maybe traveling a greater distance is part of the personal sacrifice you make to work toward perfecting the Temple. Maybe that can be part of what consecrates your work and your Lodge's work.
I agree. I also believe that sometimes as we continue down our personal Masonic pathway, what we are looking for in a Lodge might change. And I think it is perfectly OK, desirable even, to change one's Lodge affiliation when and if that happens.
Well, the first lodge I attended here in TN was a great lodge, and a little bit more in sync with my beliefs. However it's 45 minutes of back roads to get to, and needs some serious help in a couple areas. The lodge that I could literally hit with a bullet lobbed over the top of our ridge, is, well, far more Southern Baptist, and had problems conceiving of a non Christian Mason. On the other hand, they need some serious help too, and I am in a far better position to help them. They are also the oldest continuous operating lodge in TN. So I chose to go where I can do the most good.
I imagine that you will be a great influence on your new Lodge. Some Brothers do tend to forget that Freemasonry is welcoming to men of all faiths, not only the Christian faith.
It is, I think, certainly true that we can better help our Lodge if we are nearby. My wife and I would struggle mightily to cook a dinner for one of the Lodges I'm a member of in Seattle. Hell, where would we even park to unload all the food? But, we've probably cooked hundreds of meals for the Lodge in my little city, including a Thanksgiving feast tomorrow night.
Yesterday, she and I, along with another couple spent an hour or two cleaning the Lodge refrigerators and freezers. We couldn't drive to Seattle to do that. Last week a pipe fitting broke in the building. I'm not the guy to fix it, but I was able to drive down to assist as needed. Had something like that happened in Seattle and someone called me the whole place would be flooded by the time I got there.
But, it isn't just physical things, everything is easier to help with when it is closer.
Doesn't mean its impossible of course, just more difficult, and more limited.
A worthwhile Masonic experience for me is when I can make a contributin to the Lodge and the Lodge benefits me personally. For that I would gladly make a longer drive rather than walk around the corner to a Lodge that, for me, is lacking.
On this issue I think an extention of the question is what Lodge works for us over time; is the objective for the Lodge to retain members or for Masonry to retain members. I'm less willing to make long drives than I was when I became a Mason 17 years ago. And anything more than a short low-risk drive on a rainy night is simply out of bounds for me ... I can't see in dark rainy conditions.
As driving becomes more difficult one solution is to get a ride from a Brother. The other solution, which in the year 2025 we have decided to avoid, is virtual Lodge meetings. We continue to make decisions that are in line with a mindset rooted in the past while we steadfastly avoid decisions based on the current and future mindsets.
It's great that a new Mason is willing to make a long drive to attend a Lodge that meets his needs. It's also great that his schedule allows that. How many would-be Masons won't consider our Fraternity because our schedules and locations are incompatible?
I share your inability to drive in certain conditions. For me, it isn't the rain, rather it is the intensity of the darkness. Our freeways, with so much ambient light from human development, I am A-OK. Dark highways through extremely rural places, not so much.
A year or so ago a good friend invited me to his Installation as WM of his Lodge. It isn't a very long drive from my home, and it was in the afternoon, so I was very pleased to attend.
But, by the time it was over, it was getting dark. I had about an hour to go on a small two lane highway on the west side of Puget Sound. I scared the crap out of myself for about half of it, trying to drive, but unable to see much of all. It was a huge relief when I finally hit Olympia.
This has been a long time problem for me, so I generally try to talk someone into going with me who can actually see. I did decide after that trip though, that I can't do it any longer unless someone is going with me, or I have a hotel room for the night.
I completely understand being hyper-selective about the lodge one chooses to petition. It has got to feel like you belong. The lodges are families of Brothers who a man adopts that become a permanent part of his Masonic journey. It must be a fit.
While certainly not as tenured in the Craft as many, my almost 23 years as a Mason has seen me through 8 different lodges in 3 states as a dues paying or life member. Each either presented an opportunity for me to help that Lodge in some way and/or it was where I wanted to spend my time. Lodges change and evolve, cultures of lodges can shift for various reasons. Traveling is building your Masonic family tree and is as much about learning who YOU are as it is about the Lodge that you join. I am not the same man I was when I became a Mason, and some of the Lodges I am/was a part of are not the same either.
This is a great conversation to have, and thought provoking as always Cam. I just saw the play, Alice in Wonderland, and the scene with Alice and the Caterpillar made me think about the evolution of a man and the Lodges in Masonry. I hope you find this as interesting as I did as we travel on our own paths.
Thanks for your kind words, and the link! I've never actually watched Alice in Wonderland, nor do I think I've read the book. I may have to remedy that one day soon.
Your point about evolution is well taken. I don't think that I am looking for the same Lodge experience now as I was looking for as a much younger Mason. What we want and need does change over time.
And of course Lodges do change as the men within them change. When all goes well, I think, a Lodge can grow with us in a lot of ways. I've certainly seen that over my long tenure with my little city's Lodge. Improvement does come, sometimes fast, sometimes slow, always followed by a bit of backsliding it seems, but over time, with work and effort, a committed group of men, even just a handful of them, can really make a big difference for the better.
"What would a Lodge need to do in order to be so great that you’d be willing to drive an hour and a half each way to be a part of it?"
Today I want to be a contrarian and ask, "If you have three hours to drive back and forth, how could you use those three hours to contribute to your home lodge?" What needs doing in your lodge that you could do, or organize, that will make your lodge the stellar lodge you desire? Visiting a sick or homebound Brother? Learning a part of the ritual? Repairing a piece of equipment? Helping to prepare a meal? Organizing a morning coffee klatch among Brothers?
My Brother Todd astutely pointed out that Brothers and Lodges change and hopefully grow over time. Circumstances change. IMO, some Brothers have an unrealistic expectation that someone else will do the organizing, planning, and execution of a successful lodge experience. And that there is a Masonic 'Holy Grail' at some other lodge, if only we might seek it.
Now I believe there definitely is some values in travelling, both spiritual and practical, so let me paraphrase. What you have seen praiseworthy in other lodges, you should attempt to recreate and emulate; and what in your own lodge might appear defective, maybe you should bust your butt to amend.
>>>What you have seen praiseworthy in other lodges, you should attempt to recreate and >>>emulate; and what in your own lodge might appear defective, maybe you should bust >>>your butt to amend.
Oh, I certainly agree with this! We should make it a point to steal every great idea possible from the Lodges we visit. Bring them home, and implement them.
When I was Worshipful Master for the first time, I visited a Lodge over 2500 miles from home, saw what I thought was a really great idea, promptly brought it back and put it into practice. I'm still convinced, all these years later that it is the best thing I've ever done to make the Lodge experience better.
That to me is one of the most important things we can gain from visiting other Lodges, just the ability to see how others do things. Learning from each other is the best thing we can do in a lot of cases.
MWB Bailey, I think that if something is worthwhile, the distance is not as much of an obstacle. I started attending my now home Lodge well before moving closer, meaning it was about a two hour drive at the time.
I think if what we are seeking is important to us, we must be willing to sacrifice our time, efforts, and resources to participate in it.
I now live about an hour closer, and more central to my various clients and community based projects, though we plan to move even closer when the right spot becomes available. For now it allows us to be regulars in a place that we really enjoy being.
I think it is true that we truly love those things that require us to significantly sacrifice in order to receive them. That's why, I believe Freemasonry is stronger when it expects more from its Masons. Why things like 'one day classes' and watered down 'alternate proficiencies' don't work. When we make Masonry too easy, we lose.
That would not happen here where I am in Mexico... You MUST have been in Mexico for at least one year before joining any Lodge (Affiliates excepted) and/or you must be in the jurisdiction of the Lodge you petition.
And speaking of distance... this Friday I am attending to Endeavor Lodge No. 944 in the United Grand Lodge of Australia as they have their "North America Friendly Lodge"... right from the comfort of my little Mexican hacienda. This is the virtual Lodge from Melbourne and it will be on Zoom at 6:00 PM Eastern Standard Time... in Melbourne that will be about 8:00 AM on Saturday morning there!
I will be glad to send you the link should you like to attend... that will be about 9:00 PM Pacific Standard Time (please check time as I am not the best with these times). You will find some very sophisticated and wonderful Brethren there... I guarantee it! They last about 2 hours or so!
I can't make the link publicly available as this is there AND Castle Island Lodge 190 in the Grand Lodge of Manitoba's West Door! lol
By the way... my Lodge in Edmonton (although a 1/2 hour drive when I was there (I still belong to my Mother Lodge)... there were 17 Lodges meeting in the same building... could go to Lodge any day of the week except Sunday!
As I understand it, long ago in my Grand Lodge, Lodges also had specific geographical Jurisdictions, and one was required to Petition the Lodge closest to home. I'm unsure when that changed here, or what the reasoning for that change was at the time. It happened long before I became a Mason.
Thank you for the very kind invitation, I'd love to take you up on it, but unfortunately can't attend on Friday. I've got family obligations.
Im quite lucky to live 30 minutes from 5 lodges, indeed 2 of them are minutes from my house. I can travel to at least 4 more in under an hour.
I think for me, an hour is the furthest I would want to go if I wanted to be a member of a Lodge. If I am a member, I want to be active. I want to be able to help with the building and in the community. That means I need to be available.
While not addressed in your post, distance also matters for traveling to visit, for as I mentioned, I have quite a few close by. If a lodge is under 1.5 hours, odds are ive visited it already and try to do so on a regular occasion. If its more then 2 hours, I need a very compelling reason to do so.
>>>While not addressed in your post, distance also matters for traveling to visit, for as I >>>mentioned, I have quite a few close by. If a lodge is under 1.5 hours, odds are ive visited it >>>already and try to do so on a regular occasion. If its more then 2 hours, I need a very >>>compelling reason to do so.
Your point is extremely well taken.
But, for me, it is a different reason. I'm willing, and able, to travel long distances to visit a Lodge, but for me (unless someone else is going with me) it depends on the roadway. I see very poorly at night, and it has been that way for me for a long time now. I can easily drive on the freeway or other similarly lighted roadways, but some of our Lodges are served by very dark back roads, and I have great difficulty driving on them. There are Lodges I avoid for simply that reason.
I feel lucky to have completed my degrees in a lodge that fit me within 15 minutes of my house. I think fit is important. My lodge had potential members visit other lodges in the area to be sure we were the best for them. I have moved out of state and the lodge in my new hometown doesn't fit me. I am still looking for the right fit.
While distance shouldn't be the only factor I feel you need to be able to assist the lodge by more than attendance. Distance is a big part of the length of my cable tow.
I agree, it is really important that potential Masons visit other area Lodges to ensure that they choose the one that best fits them. Far too often I think we lose men from Masonry simply because they petitioned the first Lodge they encountered, and it ended up not gelling with their personality or interests. It's certainly sad if a Lodge a town over would have been a better fit, and able to retain them.
Maybe it's important to find a Lodge that vibes with your internal vision of the kind of Mason you want to grow up to be, and maybe that's more important than distance. Maybe traveling a greater distance is part of the personal sacrifice you make to work toward perfecting the Temple. Maybe that can be part of what consecrates your work and your Lodge's work.
I agree. I also believe that sometimes as we continue down our personal Masonic pathway, what we are looking for in a Lodge might change. And I think it is perfectly OK, desirable even, to change one's Lodge affiliation when and if that happens.
Well, the first lodge I attended here in TN was a great lodge, and a little bit more in sync with my beliefs. However it's 45 minutes of back roads to get to, and needs some serious help in a couple areas. The lodge that I could literally hit with a bullet lobbed over the top of our ridge, is, well, far more Southern Baptist, and had problems conceiving of a non Christian Mason. On the other hand, they need some serious help too, and I am in a far better position to help them. They are also the oldest continuous operating lodge in TN. So I chose to go where I can do the most good.
I imagine that you will be a great influence on your new Lodge. Some Brothers do tend to forget that Freemasonry is welcoming to men of all faiths, not only the Christian faith.
It is, I think, certainly true that we can better help our Lodge if we are nearby. My wife and I would struggle mightily to cook a dinner for one of the Lodges I'm a member of in Seattle. Hell, where would we even park to unload all the food? But, we've probably cooked hundreds of meals for the Lodge in my little city, including a Thanksgiving feast tomorrow night.
Yesterday, she and I, along with another couple spent an hour or two cleaning the Lodge refrigerators and freezers. We couldn't drive to Seattle to do that. Last week a pipe fitting broke in the building. I'm not the guy to fix it, but I was able to drive down to assist as needed. Had something like that happened in Seattle and someone called me the whole place would be flooded by the time I got there.
But, it isn't just physical things, everything is easier to help with when it is closer.
Doesn't mean its impossible of course, just more difficult, and more limited.
Thank you for the vote of confidence Brother.
A worthwhile Masonic experience for me is when I can make a contributin to the Lodge and the Lodge benefits me personally. For that I would gladly make a longer drive rather than walk around the corner to a Lodge that, for me, is lacking.
On this issue I think an extention of the question is what Lodge works for us over time; is the objective for the Lodge to retain members or for Masonry to retain members. I'm less willing to make long drives than I was when I became a Mason 17 years ago. And anything more than a short low-risk drive on a rainy night is simply out of bounds for me ... I can't see in dark rainy conditions.
As driving becomes more difficult one solution is to get a ride from a Brother. The other solution, which in the year 2025 we have decided to avoid, is virtual Lodge meetings. We continue to make decisions that are in line with a mindset rooted in the past while we steadfastly avoid decisions based on the current and future mindsets.
It's great that a new Mason is willing to make a long drive to attend a Lodge that meets his needs. It's also great that his schedule allows that. How many would-be Masons won't consider our Fraternity because our schedules and locations are incompatible?
I share your inability to drive in certain conditions. For me, it isn't the rain, rather it is the intensity of the darkness. Our freeways, with so much ambient light from human development, I am A-OK. Dark highways through extremely rural places, not so much.
A year or so ago a good friend invited me to his Installation as WM of his Lodge. It isn't a very long drive from my home, and it was in the afternoon, so I was very pleased to attend.
But, by the time it was over, it was getting dark. I had about an hour to go on a small two lane highway on the west side of Puget Sound. I scared the crap out of myself for about half of it, trying to drive, but unable to see much of all. It was a huge relief when I finally hit Olympia.
This has been a long time problem for me, so I generally try to talk someone into going with me who can actually see. I did decide after that trip though, that I can't do it any longer unless someone is going with me, or I have a hotel room for the night.
I completely understand being hyper-selective about the lodge one chooses to petition. It has got to feel like you belong. The lodges are families of Brothers who a man adopts that become a permanent part of his Masonic journey. It must be a fit.
While certainly not as tenured in the Craft as many, my almost 23 years as a Mason has seen me through 8 different lodges in 3 states as a dues paying or life member. Each either presented an opportunity for me to help that Lodge in some way and/or it was where I wanted to spend my time. Lodges change and evolve, cultures of lodges can shift for various reasons. Traveling is building your Masonic family tree and is as much about learning who YOU are as it is about the Lodge that you join. I am not the same man I was when I became a Mason, and some of the Lodges I am/was a part of are not the same either.
This is a great conversation to have, and thought provoking as always Cam. I just saw the play, Alice in Wonderland, and the scene with Alice and the Caterpillar made me think about the evolution of a man and the Lodges in Masonry. I hope you find this as interesting as I did as we travel on our own paths.
https://youtu.be/tf5nCPFBSHw?si=3hb1i9B_VvcGmVwR
Very well-said and thoughtful, Brother Todd!
Thanks for your kind words, and the link! I've never actually watched Alice in Wonderland, nor do I think I've read the book. I may have to remedy that one day soon.
Your point about evolution is well taken. I don't think that I am looking for the same Lodge experience now as I was looking for as a much younger Mason. What we want and need does change over time.
And of course Lodges do change as the men within them change. When all goes well, I think, a Lodge can grow with us in a lot of ways. I've certainly seen that over my long tenure with my little city's Lodge. Improvement does come, sometimes fast, sometimes slow, always followed by a bit of backsliding it seems, but over time, with work and effort, a committed group of men, even just a handful of them, can really make a big difference for the better.
"What would a Lodge need to do in order to be so great that you’d be willing to drive an hour and a half each way to be a part of it?"
Today I want to be a contrarian and ask, "If you have three hours to drive back and forth, how could you use those three hours to contribute to your home lodge?" What needs doing in your lodge that you could do, or organize, that will make your lodge the stellar lodge you desire? Visiting a sick or homebound Brother? Learning a part of the ritual? Repairing a piece of equipment? Helping to prepare a meal? Organizing a morning coffee klatch among Brothers?
My Brother Todd astutely pointed out that Brothers and Lodges change and hopefully grow over time. Circumstances change. IMO, some Brothers have an unrealistic expectation that someone else will do the organizing, planning, and execution of a successful lodge experience. And that there is a Masonic 'Holy Grail' at some other lodge, if only we might seek it.
Now I believe there definitely is some values in travelling, both spiritual and practical, so let me paraphrase. What you have seen praiseworthy in other lodges, you should attempt to recreate and emulate; and what in your own lodge might appear defective, maybe you should bust your butt to amend.
Happy Thanksgiving all!
>>>What you have seen praiseworthy in other lodges, you should attempt to recreate and >>>emulate; and what in your own lodge might appear defective, maybe you should bust >>>your butt to amend.
Oh, I certainly agree with this! We should make it a point to steal every great idea possible from the Lodges we visit. Bring them home, and implement them.
When I was Worshipful Master for the first time, I visited a Lodge over 2500 miles from home, saw what I thought was a really great idea, promptly brought it back and put it into practice. I'm still convinced, all these years later that it is the best thing I've ever done to make the Lodge experience better.
That to me is one of the most important things we can gain from visiting other Lodges, just the ability to see how others do things. Learning from each other is the best thing we can do in a lot of cases.
Happy Thanksgiving to you as well Brother.
MWB Bailey, I think that if something is worthwhile, the distance is not as much of an obstacle. I started attending my now home Lodge well before moving closer, meaning it was about a two hour drive at the time.
I think if what we are seeking is important to us, we must be willing to sacrifice our time, efforts, and resources to participate in it.
I now live about an hour closer, and more central to my various clients and community based projects, though we plan to move even closer when the right spot becomes available. For now it allows us to be regulars in a place that we really enjoy being.
I think it is true that we truly love those things that require us to significantly sacrifice in order to receive them. That's why, I believe Freemasonry is stronger when it expects more from its Masons. Why things like 'one day classes' and watered down 'alternate proficiencies' don't work. When we make Masonry too easy, we lose.
That would not happen here where I am in Mexico... You MUST have been in Mexico for at least one year before joining any Lodge (Affiliates excepted) and/or you must be in the jurisdiction of the Lodge you petition.
And speaking of distance... this Friday I am attending to Endeavor Lodge No. 944 in the United Grand Lodge of Australia as they have their "North America Friendly Lodge"... right from the comfort of my little Mexican hacienda. This is the virtual Lodge from Melbourne and it will be on Zoom at 6:00 PM Eastern Standard Time... in Melbourne that will be about 8:00 AM on Saturday morning there!
I will be glad to send you the link should you like to attend... that will be about 9:00 PM Pacific Standard Time (please check time as I am not the best with these times). You will find some very sophisticated and wonderful Brethren there... I guarantee it! They last about 2 hours or so!
I can't make the link publicly available as this is there AND Castle Island Lodge 190 in the Grand Lodge of Manitoba's West Door! lol
By the way... my Lodge in Edmonton (although a 1/2 hour drive when I was there (I still belong to my Mother Lodge)... there were 17 Lodges meeting in the same building... could go to Lodge any day of the week except Sunday!
As I understand it, long ago in my Grand Lodge, Lodges also had specific geographical Jurisdictions, and one was required to Petition the Lodge closest to home. I'm unsure when that changed here, or what the reasoning for that change was at the time. It happened long before I became a Mason.
Thank you for the very kind invitation, I'd love to take you up on it, but unfortunately can't attend on Friday. I've got family obligations.